[Marxism] ANC govt terrified of music, says Hugh Masekela [?!?!]

[glparramatta]

I'm not sure if Walter actually wants to have a serious discussion
here. But from the approach he is taking, I don't think so. It seems that
Walter now prefers to conduct his debates in a sarcastic, cavalier and
uncomradely fashion. How are we to take such an approach like this
seriously?

 > It would help me to understand the position of the Democratic
 > Socialists if they would explain if they have EVER viewed the South
 > African ANC-led government favorably. I haven't time to research
this now, but I have a feeling that the DSP has always been opposed to
the ANC.

Even though Walter proclaims he can't be bothered to take five minutes
to Google the Green Left site to discover what public stand the
``DSP'' has taken over the years on the ANC, he then goes on to
declare: ``I have a feeling that the DSP has always been opposed to
the ANC'' {!!!). (To the extent that the DSP had a ``line'' on the
``ANC government'' it was contained in the articles written by me when
the DSP sent me over there in 1993-94 to cover the formal demise of
apartheid. I continued to write on South African developments for many
years afterwards. More recently however, coverage has relied on the
efforts of Patrick Bond, Dale McKinley, Percy Ngonyama and several others.)

No Walter, to make it easier for you not to make a dill of yourself
again, I have done the Google search for you. You need only click
Here: http://tinyurl.com/3a28d2 for articles by Norm Dixon and Here:
http://tinyurl.com/3ym2y9 for all articles on the ANC in GLW. Please
judge for yourself if the ``DSP'' always opposed the ANC and only
``bashes'' the ANC.

Walter also makes the truely bizarre statement for a socialist:

 > The problem here is that the DSP blames the capitalist government of
 > South Africa for not being a revolutionary government, such as the
 > Democratic Socialists would themselves envision for South Africa.
 > It's an unreasonable standard. No government in the world can meet
 > such a standard. It's a set-up for failure. DSP has reached this
 > political conclusion, and operate from the conclusion that since
 > they must do bad things, that's all that the DSP is able to see.
 >
 > As a result of the political decision with the Democratic Socialist
 > Perspective has made that the South African Government, led by the
 > African National Congress, and which is part of a Tri-Partite
 > Alliance which includes COSATU and the South African Communist Party,
 > is both a capitalist and a Baddd government, the DSP follows a
 > policy, like that of others, to condemn the South African government
 > on every possible occasion.

Firstly, GLW reports, as accurately as we can, on developments in the
class struggle in South Africa between the South African working class
and poor communities and the ruling capitalist class and its
capitalist government.

In that struggle, we side with the workers, the poor and the
oppressed -- and that means articles that are often critical of the
neoliberal, anti-worker government of South Africa (in general the
only ``criticising'' we do is to let the facts speak for themslves). It
doesn't matter what the DSP in Australia thinks of the ANC, but what the 
working class movement and poor people in
struggle with it thinks that matters and it is that which we report.

We also attempt to present the views of the movements, including
groups directly participating in the struggles -- the
Anti-Privatisation Forum, the movements against water and electricity
cut-offs, COSATU and the SACP. We also attempt to report and reflect
the debates taking place on the SA left, including within COSATU and
the SACP, and outside of it, about the way forward to achieve a
government that genuinely rules in the interests of the workers and
poor of South Africa, and heaven forbid, at some time a socialist
South Africa.

What would Walter suggest we do otherwise. Stop reporting the class
struggle in South Africa and the views of the activist left there, for
fear that it will put the ANC regime in a bad light? Instead, trawl
for ``good news'' stories about the ANC? I suggest they are few and
far between, and to concentrate on that would simply be an excerise in
misleading our readers about the actual nature of the ANC regime and
developments in South Africa.

Socialists oppose capitalist governments and offer solidarity to those
 in struggle. Socialist seek to overthrow capitalism, don't they?
Isn't that ABC for socialists, Walter? If you lose sight of that, you
begin to start sounding like the apologists for capitalist parties and
governments like those led by the ALP here in Australia and supporters
of the Democrats in the US, who all refuse to begin the process of
building a genuine socialist alternative by whining about the
revolutionary left being ``purists'' or ``perfectionists'' or ``too
one-sided'', not understanding the ``dual nature'' of liberal
capitalist entities etc. etc., that we need an extended stage of
capitalism before we can think about a socialist stage.

 > p.s., given my commitments and priorities, I try to keep track of the
 > South African struggle, so I receive the same daily bulletin from the
 > SA Mail and Guardian which Norm receives, and from which he selects
 > his ANC-bashing documentation.

Sadly, you seem to rely only on the liberal capitalist Mail and
Guardian for your rosy-coloured view of the ANC regime. I agree it is
useful but alone is thoroughly inadequate. Again, as I did earlier, I
suggest you add the following to your reading if you genuinely want to
grasp the class struggle in South Africa:

``Search Green Left Weekly for those authors I've mentioned and read
what they have to say about both the actual reality of ANC rule and
the developing -- yes still embryonic -- opposition to the ANC's
policies. I suggest you visit the excellent new Amandla
(http://www.amandla.org.za/) website and read the many and rich debate
articles there. Regularly visit http://www.pambazuka.org/ too.
Likewise explore the Durban-based Centre for Civil Society at
http://www.ukzn.ac.za/ccs/ Join the excellent South Africa-based
Debate discussion list.

``I would also suggest you seek out news on the activities of the
Anti-Privatisation Forum in Johannesburg and the Treatment Action
Group, and the anti-eviction, anti-water and electrcity cut-off
movements throughout the country.''

Norm.


--- In GreenLeft_discussion at yahoogroups.com, Walter Lippmann
<walterlx at ...> wrote:
 >
 > The problem here is that the DSP blames the capitalist government of
 > South Africa for not being a revolutionary government, such as the
 > Democratic Socialists would themselves envision for South Africa.
 > It's an unreasonable standard. No government in the world can meet
 > such a standard. It's a set-up for failure. DSP has reached this
 > political conclusion, and operate from the conclusion that since
 > they must do bad things, that's all that the DSP is able to see.
 >
 > As a result of the political decision with the Democratic Socialist
 > Perspective has made that the South African Government, let by the
 > African National Congress, and which is part of a Tri-Partite
 > Alliance which includes COSATU and the South African Communist Party,
 > is both a capitalist and a Baddd government, the DSP follows a
 > policy, like that of others, to condemn the South African government
 > on every possible occasion.

>  
>