From m.mcdonald.10 at scu.edu.au Fri Oct 2 17:30:58 2009 From: m.mcdonald.10 at scu.edu.au (m.mcdonald.10 at scu.edu.au) Date: Sat, 03 Oct 2009 09:30:58 +1000 Subject: [Critical-Realism] AACR register and call for 'Getting Real' seminar presenters Message-ID: Hi there I am in the process of updating the Australasian Association for Critical Realism (AACR) register. Just wondering if there is anyone with an interest in critical realism and the philosophy of meta-Reality (who lives/works in Australasia) that would like to be included on the AACR register. I would appreciate it if you could get back to me in the next week or so, as I would like to send the revised edition out by mid-October. Further, the 'Getting Real' seminars at the University of Sydney have been progressing well since they began in 2006. They provide a great forum for discussing and exchanging ideas about realist philosophies and their application in a wide range of disciplines. The AACR committee are starting to organise the monthly 'Getting Real' seminars for next year. We are very interested in hearing from anyone who would like to share their work in these seminars in 2010. Warm wishes, Melanie From nellhaus at mail.com Wed Oct 7 17:09:51 2009 From: nellhaus at mail.com (Tobin Nellhaus) Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2009 19:09:51 -0400 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting Message-ID: <1864F2B1BD424C17864ED3595A148283@Godiva> Hi folks-- Is anyone aware of any book (a monograph, not a collection of articles) applying CR to a field of cultural analysis? I need to provide my publisher with some advertising copy, and I think mine may be the first -- but I thought I best ask you all. Thanks, T. --- Tobin Nellhaus nellhaus at mail.com "Faith requires us to be materialists without flinching": C.S. Peirce From J.A.Toynbee at open.ac.uk Thu Oct 8 01:31:18 2009 From: J.A.Toynbee at open.ac.uk (J.A.Toynbee) Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2009 08:31:18 +0100 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting In-Reply-To: <1864F2B1BD424C17864ED3595A148283@Godiva> References: <1864F2B1BD424C17864ED3595A148283@Godiva> Message-ID: <112AF7EB01B9CB4AB9DA385C07842DA618A41D@SALCEYCMS1.open.ac.uk> I've been searching for a while and I don't know of any. But this is really great news Tobin. Could you post the title, publisher and likely date of publication? Jason -----Original Message----- From: critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu [mailto:critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu] On Behalf Of Tobin Nellhaus Sent: 08 October 2009 00:10 To: Critical Realism List Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting Hi folks-- Is anyone aware of any book (a monograph, not a collection of articles) applying CR to a field of cultural analysis? I need to provide my publisher with some advertising copy, and I think mine may be the first -- but I thought I best ask you all. Thanks, T. --- Tobin Nellhaus nellhaus at mail.com "Faith requires us to be materialists without flinching": C.S. Peirce _______________________________________________ Critical-Realism mailing list Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism The Open University is incorporated by Royal Charter (RC 000391), an exempt charity in England & Wales and a charity registered in Scotland (SC 038302). From echna at gmx.net Thu Oct 8 06:45:36 2009 From: echna at gmx.net (echna) Date: Thu, 08 Oct 2009 14:45:36 +0200 Subject: [Critical-Realism] thesis Message-ID: <4ACDDEF0.2060205@gmx.net> Hi all, finally I finished my master?s thesis on the relation between CR and the Frankfurt School. Unfortunately it is written in German, but if anyone of you is still interested just contact me off list. I?ll send you a copy. best wishes, e From rgroff at slu.edu Thu Oct 8 07:03:05 2009 From: rgroff at slu.edu (Ruth Groff) Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2009 08:03:05 -0500 Subject: [Critical-Realism] thesis In-Reply-To: <4ACDDEF0.2060205@gmx.net> References: <4ACDDEF0.2060205@gmx.net> Message-ID: <6ad241360910080603u3d86843fxb0d54819354d284a@mail.gmail.com> Congratulations! I don't read German, alas, but if I did, I would want a copy! rg On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 7:45 AM, echna wrote: > Hi all, > > finally I finished my master?s thesis on the relation between CR and the > Frankfurt School. Unfortunately it is written in German, but if anyone > of you is still interested just contact me off list. I?ll send you a copy. > > best wishes, > e > > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > From nellhaus at mail.com Thu Oct 8 14:42:41 2009 From: nellhaus at mail.com (Tobin Nellhaus) Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2009 16:42:41 -0400 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting In-Reply-To: <112AF7EB01B9CB4AB9DA385C07842DA618A41D@SALCEYCMS1.open.ac.uk> References: <1864F2B1BD424C17864ED3595A148283@Godiva> <112AF7EB01B9CB4AB9DA385C07842DA618A41D@SALCEYCMS1.open.ac.uk> Message-ID: <87DB35625F404011A546CBA08A506C4A@Godiva> Hi Jason, The title is "Theater, Communication, Critical Realism." Palgrave, 2010 (probably late summer or fall). Cheers, Tobin ----- Original Message ----- From: "J.A.Toynbee" To: "'Continuation of the Spoon Bhaskar List'" Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 3:31 AM Subject: Re: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting > I've been searching for a while and I don't know of any. But this is > really great news Tobin. Could you post the title, publisher and likely > date of publication? > > Jason > > > -----Original Message----- > From: critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu > [mailto:critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu] On Behalf Of Tobin > Nellhaus > Sent: 08 October 2009 00:10 > To: Critical Realism List > Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting > > Hi folks-- > > Is anyone aware of any book (a monograph, not a collection of articles) > applying CR to a field of cultural analysis? I need to provide my > publisher with some advertising copy, and I think mine may be the first -- > but I thought I best ask you all. > > Thanks, > > T. > > --- > Tobin Nellhaus > nellhaus at mail.com > "Faith requires us to be materialists without flinching": C.S. Peirce > > > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > > > The Open University is incorporated by Royal Charter (RC 000391), an > exempt charity in England & Wales and a charity registered in Scotland (SC > 038302). > > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism From bwanika at yahoo.com Fri Oct 9 03:01:33 2009 From: bwanika at yahoo.com (BD_wanika) Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 02:01:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Critical-Realism] on methodology Message-ID: <669738.87899.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Help with a critical realist methodological view, on the immensurability of value, virtual and judgement etc. Daniel From rgroff at slu.edu Sat Oct 10 21:22:50 2009 From: rgroff at slu.edu (Ruth Groff) Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2009 22:22:50 -0500 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting In-Reply-To: <87DB35625F404011A546CBA08A506C4A@Godiva> References: <1864F2B1BD424C17864ED3595A148283@Godiva> <112AF7EB01B9CB4AB9DA385C07842DA618A41D@SALCEYCMS1.open.ac.uk> <87DB35625F404011A546CBA08A506C4A@Godiva> Message-ID: <6ad241360910102022h7fe83c70w11d11f93959bd6eb@mail.gmail.com> CONGRATULATIONS TOBIN!!!! On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Tobin Nellhaus wrote: > Hi Jason, > > The title is "Theater, Communication, Critical Realism." Palgrave, 2010 > (probably late summer or fall). > > Cheers, > > Tobin > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "J.A.Toynbee" > To: "'Continuation of the Spoon Bhaskar List'" > > Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 3:31 AM > Subject: Re: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting > > > > I've been searching for a while and I don't know of any. But this is > > really great news Tobin. Could you post the title, publisher and likely > > date of publication? > > > > Jason > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu > > [mailto:critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu] On Behalf Of Tobin > > Nellhaus > > Sent: 08 October 2009 00:10 > > To: Critical Realism List > > Subject: [Critical-Realism] Preparatory to minor horn-tooting > > > > Hi folks-- > > > > Is anyone aware of any book (a monograph, not a collection of articles) > > applying CR to a field of cultural analysis? I need to provide my > > publisher with some advertising copy, and I think mine may be the first > -- > > but I thought I best ask you all. > > > > Thanks, > > > > T. > > > > --- > > Tobin Nellhaus > > nellhaus at mail.com > > "Faith requires us to be materialists without flinching": C.S. Peirce > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Critical-Realism mailing list > > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > > > > > > The Open University is incorporated by Royal Charter (RC 000391), an > > exempt charity in England & Wales and a charity registered in Scotland > (SC > > 038302). > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Critical-Realism mailing list > > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > > > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > From rgroff at slu.edu Sat Oct 10 21:29:33 2009 From: rgroff at slu.edu (Ruth Groff) Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2009 22:29:33 -0500 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Help w syllabus for a colleague Message-ID: <6ad241360910102029l660b8d2bha92cc841973bf3c4@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, I told a colleague I would ask people on the list for good treatments of the issue of agency and structure suitable for undergrads in a qualitative methods course. I suggested that countless brilliant cr-ers would suggest all manner of perfect thing, which I could then forward on to him. Thanks in advance! r. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Robert Strikwerda Date: Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 5:07 PM Subject: Agency /Structure Explanation To: Ruth Groff Ruth, I've written it for you: This is for a colleague who is teaching a Qualitative Interpretive Research Methods course with Women's Studies, Communication, and Political Science students. And their acquaintance with sociological theory is definitely thin. He would like to assign a reading explaining the Agency-Structure relationship to build up their thinking about research. Can anyone recommend an article, a book chapter that introduces these ideas with in the context of how one studies such, e.g. with examples? Thanks. -- Robert A Strikwerda Visiting Associate Prof. Women's Studies 143A McGannon Hall Saint Louis University Director of the Honors Program (on leave) Indiana University Kokomo From d.eldervass at ntlworld.com Sun Oct 11 10:56:49 2009 From: d.eldervass at ntlworld.com (Dave Elder-Vass) Date: Sun, 11 Oct 2009 17:56:49 +0100 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Help w syllabus for a colleague References: <6ad241360910102029l660b8d2bha92cc841973bf3c4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Ruth, There are two useful little books in the Open University's 'Concepts in the Social Sciences' series: a) Lopez and Scott 'Social Structure' - gives a useful analytical overview of a broad sweep of different treatments of social structure up to Giddens and Bourdieu. b) Parker 'Structuration' - chapters on Giddens and Bourdieu, labelled 'structurationists', but also sympathetic chapters on Archer and Mouzelis, labelled 'post-structurationists'. The chapter on Archer is the best short introduction I've seen. A bit Anglo-centric, perhaps, as it neglects the American relationists (Sewell, Somers, Emirbayer), who might be more interesting to US students than Mouzelis. I hope this is useful! Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ruth Groff" To: "Continuation of the Spoon Bhaskar List" Cc: "Robert Strikwerda" Sent: 11 October 2009 04:29 Subject: [Critical-Realism] Help w syllabus for a colleague > Hi all, > > I told a colleague I would ask people on the list for good treatments of > the > issue of agency and structure suitable for undergrads in a qualitative > methods course. > > I suggested that countless brilliant cr-ers would suggest all manner of > perfect thing, which I could then forward on to him. > > Thanks in advance! > > r. > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Robert Strikwerda > Date: Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 5:07 PM > Subject: Agency /Structure Explanation > To: Ruth Groff > > > Ruth, I've written it for you: > > This is for a colleague who is teaching a Qualitative Interpretive > Research > Methods course with Women's Studies, Communication, and Political Science > students. And their acquaintance with sociological theory is definitely > thin. He would like to assign a reading explaining the Agency-Structure > relationship to build up their thinking about research. Can anyone > recommend an article, a book chapter that introduces these ideas with in > the > context of how one studies such, e.g. with examples? Thanks. > > -- > Robert A Strikwerda > Visiting Associate Prof. Women's Studies > 143A McGannon Hall > Saint Louis University > > Director of the Honors Program (on leave) > Indiana University Kokomo > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > From bwanika at yahoo.com Sun Oct 11 21:37:10 2009 From: bwanika at yahoo.com (BD_wanika) Date: Sun, 11 Oct 2009 20:37:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Critical-Realism] What is wrong with Aristotelian Logic vs CR Methodology Message-ID: <548225.43795.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Listers Help with some ideas. ? ? The Aristotelian Logic has a supposition that: ? ?????????????????????? A=B ?????????????????????? B=A ????? Therefore C=A ? Bhaskar Roy in his methodology (Logic of Scientific Discovery) asserts that, objects of nature generate knowledge about themselves. In short invaliditating the above Aristotelian Logic that deduces from the abstract, the unknown.? ? Is it that because scientists do not know (yet to discover), that objects of knowledge do not exist?! ? That the falsity in: ? A theory, T, is a structure (H, I) where H is a set of hypotheses and I is relation in H called ?implication? or ?deductibility?, So that H is weakly connected by I. ? Critical realist have asserted, in addition to what Bhaskar Roy discovered in the Logic of Scientific Discovery, that things of nature have dispositions, propensities and properties as their essential essences. (Values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc,.) ? Brian Ellis too, rejected the above notation and instead proposed for a causal theory of intrinsicality (Brian Ellis 2001) as opposed to a logical one, hence C # A, in all worlds (my emphasis).? E.g. will falling trees make sound in a world with no gravitational force? ? The above thus informs us that nature can be studied either using: ? a.??????? Causal theory of intrinsicality (Brian Ellis) b.??????? Identification of the interconnectedness domains and generated causal powers (Roy Bhaskars) c.??????? A theory of ?dialectical causality? (Bwanikas? theoryJ) ? as opposed to the Aristotelian Criteria. ? With dialectical causality, a researcher has to sufficiently identify the nature of things and its components and content. That is, what is in C that makes it equal to A. ? The theories above render both inductive and deductive logic toothless. ? The Greeks were about to solve this issue by saying that nature is not so complex once its components are explicitly identified. Indeed with Bhaskar Logic, there is a good chance of measuring; values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc., once they are identified as components of the object under study. ? d. ? ?? Daniel Bwanika www.idrc-ug.com From philidorposition at gmail.com Tue Oct 13 12:24:36 2009 From: philidorposition at gmail.com (none none) Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2009 21:24:36 +0300 Subject: [Critical-Realism] What is wrong with Aristotelian Logic vs CR Methodology In-Reply-To: <548225.43795.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <548225.43795.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Maybe it's just me, but I think it's very hard to understand your point. In my opinion, if any scientist would ever find out that A=B and that B=C, he/she wouldn't hesitate to come up with the theory A=C for even a second. When you "summarize" Aristotelian Logic like that, you're actually not saying much about his ideas on scientific discovery or knowledge etc. * "Bhaskar Roy in his methodology (Logic of Scientific Discovery) asserts that, objects of nature generate knowledge about themselves. In short invaliditating the above Aristotelian Logic that deduces from the abstract, the unknown. " * I don't see how that invalidates the above logic (A=C). Bhaskar's theory seems more about how to get to the point where you find out A=B and B=C, I don't think he would have any problems with reaching the conclusion that A=C after those two steps. If you'd be referring to Hegel, instead of Bhaskar for example, that would make much more sense to me, because it can be argued that Hegel would immediately oppose all of the equations above. *"Critical realist have asserted, in addition to what Bhaskar Roy discovered in the Logic of Scientific Discovery, that things of nature have dispositions, propensities and properties as their essential essences. (Values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc,.)" *Would you please cite resources if possible? It seems very unlikely that any critical realist would claim that things of nature (a banana, let's say) have happiness or judgement. On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 6:37 AM, BD_wanika wrote: > > > Listers > Help with some ideas. > > > > > > > The > Aristotelian Logic has a supposition that: > > > > A=B > > B=A > > Therefore C=A > > > > Bhaskar Roy in his methodology (Logic of > Scientific Discovery) asserts that, objects of nature generate knowledge > about > themselves. In short invaliditating the above Aristotelian Logic that > deduces > from the abstract, the unknown. > > > > Is it that because scientists do not know > (yet to discover), that objects of knowledge do not exist?! > > > > That the falsity in: > > > > A theory, T, is a structure (H, > I) where > > H is a set of hypotheses and > > I is relation in H called > ?implication? or ?deductibility?, > > So > that H is weakly connected by I. > > > > Critical realist have asserted, in addition to > what Bhaskar Roy discovered in the Logic of Scientific Discovery, that > things > of nature have dispositions, propensities and properties as their > essential essences. (Values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc,.) > > > > Brian Ellis too, > rejected the above notation and instead proposed for a causal theory of > intrinsicality (Brian Ellis 2001) as opposed to a logical one, hence C # A, > in all > worlds (my emphasis). E.g. will falling > trees make sound in a world with no gravitational force? > > > > The above thus > informs us that nature can be studied either using: > > > > a. > Causal theory of intrinsicality (Brian Ellis) > > b. > Identification > of the interconnectedness domains and generated causal powers (Roy > Bhaskars) > > c. > A theory of ?dialectical causality? (Bwanikas? theoryJ) > > > > as opposed to the > Aristotelian Criteria. > > > > With dialectical > causality, a researcher has to sufficiently identify the nature of things > and > its components and content. That is, what is in C that makes it equal to A. > > > > The theories above > render both inductive and deductive logic toothless. > > > > The Greeks were about > to solve this issue by saying that nature is not so complex once its > components > are explicitly identified. Indeed with Bhaskar Logic, there is a good > chance of > measuring; values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc., once they are > identified as components of the object under study. > > > > d. > > > > > > > > Daniel Bwanika www.idrc-ug.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > From mh at jaspere7.demon.co.uk Wed Oct 14 06:39:22 2009 From: mh at jaspere7.demon.co.uk (Mervyn Hartwig) Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2009 13:39:22 +0100 Subject: [Critical-Realism] A critical realist in Lambeth Palace? Message-ID: Archbishop Rowan Williams says climate crisis a chance to become human again "Many of the things which have moved us towards ecological disaster have been distortions of who and what we are and their overall effect has been to isolate us from the reality we're part of. Our response to this crisis needs to be, in the most basic sense, a reality check." More at http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/oct/13/rowan-williams-climate-crisis Mervyn From pip.boucher at gmail.com Thu Oct 15 11:03:56 2009 From: pip.boucher at gmail.com (Philip Boucher) Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2009 18:03:56 +0100 Subject: [Critical-Realism] convergence on epistemological relativism Message-ID: Hi all, I recently saw a reference to something (a paper, a chapter, a conference..?) which was titled something like 'epistemological relativism- the point of convergence for postmodernism and CR'.. I may have dreamt it- but does that ring any bells? Can anyone point me back to it? Ta, Philip 2009/9/8 Philip Boucher : > Hiya, > CR would say that society and social objects do exist, because social > objects (e.g. values, aspirations, interest rates) possess causal > power. > > In terms of how they might have a material existence (which is a > different question to their having a bona fide existence) you could > use emergence- a social reality emerges from biological and other > material realities, they are constituted by them. ?The following might > be good for this: > ELDER-VASS, D. (2005) Emergence and the Realist Account of Cause. > Journal of Critical Realism, 4, 315-338. > COLLIER, A. (1989) Scientific Realism and Socialist Thought, > Hertfordshire, Harvester Wheatsheaf. > > Another way in which the socially real might be considered materially > real is in artifacts ?(this is related to emergence- it might just be > a more specific example of it). Artifacts ?have material and social > (Fleetwood would say 'ideally real') dimensions, see here- > FLEETWOOD, S. (2005) Ontology in Organization and Management Studies: > A Critical Realist Perspective. Organization, 12, 197-222. > > Lawson has discussed these in the context of technological artifacts > whereby, for instance, a design process includes a materialisation of > social values, aspirations, desires etc, which adds a durability to > their concept-time-space dependency. ?This is laid out here: > LAWSON, C. (2008) An Ontology of Technology. Techn?, 12, 48-64. > > Thanks everyone for your interesting discussion! > Cheers, > Philip > > -- > http://www.tyndall.ac.uk/generate/staffprint/staff-view.php?id=4153 > -- http://www.tyndall.ac.uk/users/philip-boucher From bwanika at yahoo.com Sun Oct 18 09:07:38 2009 From: bwanika at yahoo.com (BD_wanika) Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2009 08:07:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Critical-Realism] What is wrong with Aristotelian Logic vs CR Methodology Message-ID: <139350.26682.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> ?Hi None ? */Maybe it's just me, but I think it's very hard to understand your point. In my opinion, if any scientist would ever find out that A=B and that B=C, he/she wouldn't hesitate to come up with the theory A=C for even a second. /* ? ? The point your making is very important. Prof. Wittgenstein Ludvig. (1953) Philosophical Investigation Oxford Blackwell 2000 (3 rd edition translated by G.E.M. Anscombe), found it out as a logical criterion to explain the world but which was not a sufficient enough to explain it conclusively. ? A=B is simply a logical statement that presupposes the validity of statement B=C then, followed by a conclusion C=A, a hypothetical model so to say. ? Some researchers refer to the above as a linguistic fallacy. ? Theoretical postulations do not neccessary start with hypothetical models but rather with modelling of real entities, for example observable structures analogous to organised structures and/?or structures constitutive of factors of the studied entity. ? Tobin Nellhaus?s (1998), Signs, Social Ontology and Critical Realism pg. 1 ? 25. Journal for The Theory of Social Behaviour Vol. 28. No 1 March 1998 Editor: Charles W. Smith. Blackwell Publisher, highlights the problem clearly. ? In his book Brian Ellis 2001, Scientific Essentialism. Cambridge University press, offers a comprehensive elaboration of what things of nature that are investigated or rather studied by scientist of all types, are. ? He states,?"things of nature he refers to as natural kinds have essential essences he terms dispositions, propensities and properties." These essences are termed as emergent properties or generative mechanisms by Bhaskar Roy. ? Gold (a metal) does not behave as copper (a metal), neither do red bananas (plant) neccessarily grow in the same conditions as yellow bananas (plant). ? Logically, the above will imply red bananas has a set of essences that yellow bananas do not have even though they are all bananas. Both on natural and social science levels, in all the Bhaskarian domains of the Real, Actual and Empirical the above applies. ? Psychologists in latitudinal children and youth development studies, will come to different results in urban and rural areas. ? The above tells us that, knowledge is structured and the world in which that knowledge is derived is also structured and not exhausted by one type of knowledge or the other. ? Any one can test the non-applicability of the Aristotelian criteria i.e. on: ? 1.?????? Physicality of falling Apples from apple trees. The circumstances are biological rather than being physical. Does it imply therefore that when an apple falls off an apple tree its mass (weight * force) is less than gravitational force? 2.?????? Economic input /output theory i.e. public (Keynesian) or mortgage investment, or stock exchange placement. The current economic conditions rules out the Keynesian theory, even though the theory worked in a particular condition. 3.?????? The three physical state of water; gas (steam/vapour), liquid and solid (ice) 4.?????? Metal copper does not behave in the same way as powder copper 5.?????? Crompton Rosemary and Fiaona Harris (1997), Vol.40 No.2 Women?s Employment and Gender Attitudes: A comparative analysis of Britain, Norway and the Czech Republic. ? ? */Lastly you write that ? It seems very unlikely that any critical realist would claim that things of nature (a banana, let's say) have happiness or judgement./* ? I did not say that. However we have heard of excite particles or atoms. ? Indeed, Water lilies do not thrive in desert conditions i.e. near an aquifer.? But that does not mean water lilies do not grow in deserts at all. Does it? ? Thriving of water lilies in water might be their emergent property attributed to water ? lily relation. Is that a value or judgement of the nature of water lilies? ? Paul Ricoeur?s theory of interpretation of actions shows the problem generated above clearly. Moving from the epistemology of existential understanding (xU) to explanation E (xU ? E[a]) and grounding explanation of action (a) for existential understanding (E[a] ? xU) to understand acts in nature. ? ? Dan B. ? When you "summarize" Aristotelian Logic like that, you're actually not saying much about his ideas on scientific discovery or knowledge etc. * "Bhaskar Roy in his methodology (Logic of Scientific Discovery) asserts that, objects of nature generate knowledge about themselves. In short invaliditating the above Aristotelian Logic that deduces from the abstract, the unknown. " * I don't see how that invalidates the above logic (A=C). Bhaskar's theory seems more about how to get to the point where you find out A=B and B=C, I don't think he would have any problems with reaching the conclusion that A=C after those two steps. If you'd be referring to Hegel, instead of Bhaskar for example, that would make much more sense to me, because it can be argued that Hegel would immediately oppose all of the equations above. ? *"Critical realist have asserted, in addition to what Bhaskar Roy discovered in the Logic of Scientific Discovery, that things of nature have dispositions, propensities and properties as their essential essences. (Values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc,.)" ? *Would you please cite resources if possible? It seems very unlikely that any critical realist would claim that things of nature (a banana, let's say) have happiness or judgement. ? ? From bwanika at yahoo.com Sun Oct 18 09:07:38 2009 From: bwanika at yahoo.com (BD_wanika) Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2009 08:07:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Critical-Realism] What is wrong with Aristotelian Logic vs CR Methodology Message-ID: <139350.26682.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> ?Hi None ? */Maybe it's just me, but I think it's very hard to understand your point. In my opinion, if any scientist would ever find out that A=B and that B=C, he/she wouldn't hesitate to come up with the theory A=C for even a second. /* ? ? The point your making is very important. Prof. Wittgenstein Ludvig. (1953) Philosophical Investigation Oxford Blackwell 2000 (3 rd edition translated by G.E.M. Anscombe), found it out as a logical criterion to explain the world but which was not a sufficient enough to explain it conclusively. ? A=B is simply a logical statement that presupposes the validity of statement B=C then, followed by a conclusion C=A, a hypothetical model so to say. ? Some researchers refer to the above as a linguistic fallacy. ? Theoretical postulations do not neccessary start with hypothetical models but rather with modelling of real entities, for example observable structures analogous to organised structures and/?or structures constitutive of factors of the studied entity. ? Tobin Nellhaus?s (1998), Signs, Social Ontology and Critical Realism pg. 1 ? 25. Journal for The Theory of Social Behaviour Vol. 28. No 1 March 1998 Editor: Charles W. Smith. Blackwell Publisher, highlights the problem clearly. ? In his book Brian Ellis 2001, Scientific Essentialism. Cambridge University press, offers a comprehensive elaboration of what things of nature that are investigated or rather studied by scientist of all types, are. ? He states,?"things of nature he refers to as natural kinds have essential essences he terms dispositions, propensities and properties." These essences are termed as emergent properties or generative mechanisms by Bhaskar Roy. ? Gold (a metal) does not behave as copper (a metal), neither do red bananas (plant) neccessarily grow in the same conditions as yellow bananas (plant). ? Logically, the above will imply red bananas has a set of essences that yellow bananas do not have even though they are all bananas. Both on natural and social science levels, in all the Bhaskarian domains of the Real, Actual and Empirical the above applies. ? Psychologists in latitudinal children and youth development studies, will come to different results in urban and rural areas. ? The above tells us that, knowledge is structured and the world in which that knowledge is derived is also structured and not exhausted by one type of knowledge or the other. ? Any one can test the non-applicability of the Aristotelian criteria i.e. on: ? 1.?????? Physicality of falling Apples from apple trees. The circumstances are biological rather than being physical. Does it imply therefore that when an apple falls off an apple tree its mass (weight * force) is less than gravitational force? 2.?????? Economic input /output theory i.e. public (Keynesian) or mortgage investment, or stock exchange placement. The current economic conditions rules out the Keynesian theory, even though the theory worked in a particular condition. 3.?????? The three physical state of water; gas (steam/vapour), liquid and solid (ice) 4.?????? Metal copper does not behave in the same way as powder copper 5.?????? Crompton Rosemary and Fiaona Harris (1997), Vol.40 No.2 Women?s Employment and Gender Attitudes: A comparative analysis of Britain, Norway and the Czech Republic. ? ? */Lastly you write that ? It seems very unlikely that any critical realist would claim that things of nature (a banana, let's say) have happiness or judgement./* ? I did not say that. However we have heard of excite particles or atoms. ? Indeed, Water lilies do not thrive in desert conditions i.e. near an aquifer.? But that does not mean water lilies do not grow in deserts at all. Does it? ? Thriving of water lilies in water might be their emergent property attributed to water ? lily relation. Is that a value or judgement of the nature of water lilies? ? Paul Ricoeur?s theory of interpretation of actions shows the problem generated above clearly. Moving from the epistemology of existential understanding (xU) to explanation E (xU ? E[a]) and grounding explanation of action (a) for existential understanding (E[a] ? xU) to understand acts in nature. ? ? Dan B. ? When you "summarize" Aristotelian Logic like that, you're actually not saying much about his ideas on scientific discovery or knowledge etc. * "Bhaskar Roy in his methodology (Logic of Scientific Discovery) asserts that, objects of nature generate knowledge about themselves. In short invaliditating the above Aristotelian Logic that deduces from the abstract, the unknown. " * I don't see how that invalidates the above logic (A=C). Bhaskar's theory seems more about how to get to the point where you find out A=B and B=C, I don't think he would have any problems with reaching the conclusion that A=C after those two steps. If you'd be referring to Hegel, instead of Bhaskar for example, that would make much more sense to me, because it can be argued that Hegel would immediately oppose all of the equations above. ? *"Critical realist have asserted, in addition to what Bhaskar Roy discovered in the Logic of Scientific Discovery, that things of nature have dispositions, propensities and properties as their essential essences. (Values, judgments, vitality, happiness etc,.)" ? *Would you please cite resources if possible? It seems very unlikely that any critical realist would claim that things of nature (a banana, let's say) have happiness or judgement. ? ? From mh at jaspere7.demon.co.uk Mon Oct 19 02:38:48 2009 From: mh at jaspere7.demon.co.uk (Mervyn Hartwig) Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 09:38:48 +0100 Subject: [Critical-Realism] JCR, Call for Papers, special issue on Dialectic Message-ID: Call for Papers: Special Issue of Journal of Critical Realism Dialectic Journal of Critical Realism 10(4) 2011 Special issue editor: Jamie Morgan General editor: Mervyn Hartwig Submission deadline: 24 January 2011 http://www.equinoxjournals.com/ojs/index.php/JCR CALL FOR PAPERS In Dialectic: The Pulse of Freedom (DPF) Roy Bhaskar argued that emancipation needs realist dialectics. DPF, a challenging and difficult book for many critical realists, has now been in print for 16 years. During the years since its publication the general concept of dialectic has not been a main current in philosophy, social theory or the humanities. There has, however, been in recent years a gradual recognition of the potential of dialectical theory. Chris Arthur's The New Dialectic, Alan Norrie's Dialectic and Difference and Sean Creaven's Emergentist Marxism are just three examples of this recognition. We feel that now is an opportune time to invite papers to engage with dialectic and with its relation to critical realist thought and a wider world in crisis and transition. We invite contributions from authors in any discipline who have an interest in elaborating, critiquing or, especially, applying such thinkers as Hegel, Marx, Engels, Lenin, Ilyenkov, Adorno, Ollman, Jameson, and Bhaskar. More philosophical papers might address such questions as the relative adequacy of dialectical concepts of contradiction, absence, change, totality and emancipation. More applied papers might address such questions as the contribution of a dialectical approach to a realist account of some concrete phenomena (the environment, the economy, etc.). In all cases it should be noted that it is a requirement that the submission engage at some level with critical realism. This could take the form of an irrealist critique (for example from a ?i?ekian perspective) of critical realist dialectics, or vice versa. Papers will not be rejected for taking a critical line regarding critical realism so long as the basis of the critique is clear and original. SUBMISSIONS Submissions should be made on-line at http://www.equinoxjournals.com/ojs/index.php/JCR (After registering and logging in, please click on For Authors, then Online Submissions and follow the instructions. Include a Comment for the Editor that the submission is for the special issue on dialectic.) INSTRUCTIONS FOR AUTHORS Papers should be no more than 8,000 words. In all other respects, our Author Guidelines apply. Please consult these at http://www.equinoxjournals.com/ojs/index.php/JCR (after clicking on For Authors, click on Author Guidelines). Papers will be subject to both internal and external peer review. IMPORTANT DATES 24 January 2011: submission deadline 1 July 2011: final revision deadline October 2011: publication ABOUT JCR Journal of Critical Realism (JCR) is the journal of the International Association for Critical Realism (IACR), established in 1997 to foster the discussion, propagation and development of critical realist approaches to understanding and changing the world. It provides a forum for scholars wishing to promote realist emancipatory philosophy, social theory and science on an interdisciplinary and international basis, and for those who wish to engage with such an Mervyn Hartwig General Editor Journal of Critical Realism ISSN: 1476-7430 (print) ISSN: 1572-5138 (online) http://www.equinoxjournals.com/ojs/index.php/JCR From nellhaus at mail.com Mon Oct 19 20:35:46 2009 From: nellhaus at mail.com (Tobin Nellhaus) Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 22:35:46 -0400 Subject: [Critical-Realism] IACR conference Message-ID: Does anyone know the dates of the next IACR conference (even approximately)? Thanks, Tobin --- Tobin Nellhaus nellhaus at mail.com "Faith requires us to be materialists without flinching": C.S. Peirce From mh at jaspere7.demon.co.uk Tue Oct 20 05:07:01 2009 From: mh at jaspere7.demon.co.uk (Mervyn Hartwig) Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:07:01 +0100 Subject: [Critical-Realism] IACR conference In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 17-18 July (Workshop), 19-21 July (Conference), Padua, Italy. Subject to confirmation. Mervyn -----Original Message----- From: critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu [mailto:critical-realism-bounces at lists.econ.utah.edu] On Behalf Of Tobin Nellhaus Sent: 20 October 2009 03:36 To: Critical Realism List Subject: [Critical-Realism] IACR conference Does anyone know the dates of the next IACR conference (even approximately)? Thanks, Tobin --- Tobin Nellhaus nellhaus at mail.com "Faith requires us to be materialists without flinching": C.S. Peirce _______________________________________________ Critical-Realism mailing list Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism __________ NOD32 4525 (20091020) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com From echna at gmx.net Thu Oct 22 01:10:09 2009 From: echna at gmx.net (echna at gmx.net) Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:10:09 +0200 Subject: [Critical-Realism] CR in the Netherlands/Benelux? Message-ID: <20091022071009.212420@gmx.net> Hi all, after finishing my master's degree I plan now for personal reasons to move to the Netherlands. Therefore I would be very interested in critical-realist or in general critical(or, though the terms are not interchangeable, marxist) research and scholars in the abovementioned area. I want to find/do a PhD here, which is somewhat related to CR and critical social theorizing. So, if you can point my attention to some critical theory or persons I could contact in the 'Lowlands' (or the Benelux-countries) I would be very grateful. best wishes from Rotterdam/NL, e -- Where everything is bad it must be good to know the worst.(F.H. Bradley) Neu: GMX DSL bis 50.000 kBit/s und 200,- Euro Startguthaben! http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/dsl02 From benjamin.corrigan at gmail.com Thu Oct 22 01:25:23 2009 From: benjamin.corrigan at gmail.com (Ben Corrigan) Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 15:25:23 +0800 Subject: [Critical-Realism] CR in the Netherlands/Benelux? In-Reply-To: <20091022071009.212420@gmx.net> References: <20091022071009.212420@gmx.net> Message-ID: <8902a3460910220025tf3e60fcie9e65dded58c8799@mail.gmail.com> Hi Echna, I know Sietze Vellema and Harro Maat of the Technology and Agrarian Development Chairgroup (TAO) at Wageningen University teach Bhaskar's principles as part of their courses.. Good luck, Ben Corrigan -- Affiliate MSc Scholar Crop and Environmental Sciences Division International Rice Research Institute Cell Philippines: +63 9396 565378 Skype: ben.corrigan 2009/10/22 > Hi all, > > after finishing my master's degree I plan now for personal reasons to move > to the Netherlands. Therefore I would be very interested in critical-realist > or in general critical(or, though the terms are not interchangeable, > marxist) research and scholars in the abovementioned area. I want to find/do > a PhD here, which is somewhat related to CR and critical social theorizing. > So, if you can point my attention to some critical theory or persons I could > contact in the 'Lowlands' (or the Benelux-countries) I would be very > grateful. > > best wishes from Rotterdam/NL, > e > -- > Where everything is bad it must be good to know the > worst.(F.H. Bradley) > > Neu: GMX DSL bis 50.000 kBit/s und 200,- Euro Startguthaben! > http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/dsl02 > > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > -- Affiliate MSc Thesis Research Crop and Environmental Sciences Division International Rice Research Institute Cell Philippines: + 63 9396 565378 Skype: ben.corrigan From echna at gmx.net Fri Oct 23 01:08:26 2009 From: echna at gmx.net (echna echnatron) Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 09:08:26 +0200 Subject: [Critical-Realism] CR in the Netherlands/Benelux? In-Reply-To: <8902a3460910220025tf3e60fcie9e65dded58c8799@mail.gmail.com> References: <20091022071009.212420@gmx.net> <8902a3460910220025tf3e60fcie9e65dded58c8799@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20091023070826.139560@gmx.net> Hi again, thanks to everyone, who contacted me on or off list, so as to give me some further informations. I can start to get in touch with some other people in the NL now:-) best, e -------- Original-Nachricht -------- > Datum: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 15:25:23 +0800 > Von: Ben Corrigan > An: Continuation of the Spoon Bhaskar List > Betreff: Re: [Critical-Realism] CR in the Netherlands/Benelux? > Hi Echna, > > I know Sietze Vellema and Harro Maat of the Technology and Agrarian > Development Chairgroup (TAO) at Wageningen University teach Bhaskar's > principles as part of their courses.. > > Good luck, > > Ben Corrigan > > -- > Affiliate MSc Scholar > Crop and Environmental Sciences Division > International Rice Research Institute > > Cell Philippines: +63 9396 565378 > Skype: ben.corrigan > > 2009/10/22 > > > Hi all, > > > > after finishing my master's degree I plan now for personal reasons to > move > > to the Netherlands. Therefore I would be very interested in > critical-realist > > or in general critical(or, though the terms are not interchangeable, > > marxist) research and scholars in the abovementioned area. I want to > find/do > > a PhD here, which is somewhat related to CR and critical social > theorizing. > > So, if you can point my attention to some critical theory or persons I > could > > contact in the 'Lowlands' (or the Benelux-countries) I would be very > > grateful. > > > > best wishes from Rotterdam/NL, > > e > > -- > > Where everything is bad it must be good to know the > > worst.(F.H. Bradley) > > > > Neu: GMX DSL bis 50.000 kBit/s und 200,- Euro Startguthaben! > > http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/dsl02 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Critical-Realism mailing list > > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism > > > > > > -- > Affiliate MSc Thesis Research > Crop and Environmental Sciences Division > International Rice Research Institute > > Cell Philippines: + 63 9396 565378 > Skype: ben.corrigan > _______________________________________________ > Critical-Realism mailing list > Critical-Realism at lists.econ.utah.edu > http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/critical-realism -- Where everything is bad it must be good to know the worst.(F.H. Bradley) GRATIS f?r alle GMX-Mitglieder: Die maxdome Movie-FLAT! Jetzt freischalten unter http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/maxdome01